utena intermission 2: what is this homestuck

[a_flyleaf]

Post-watch thoughts, and snippets from a Discord chat.

unedited post-watch prattlings

• happened to notice someone I’m subscribed to (from ages ago—if you’re still here, 👋 hi!) also liveblogged utena; oh son of a bitch there’s Destruction Imagery right there in the intro
• they also pointed out the rose imagery comes from the prince. this dude’s influence is everywhere on this show including the meta-framing (but particularly the fairytale segments, duly noted)
• love as possession?? at least under The System, and it’s better when it’s not [or, to rephrase that last bit: love is better when it’s not framed as ownership]

somewhat-truncated discord chats with my wonderful partner, as sparked by this post

a-flyleaf
I think I can kiiiiinda parse [the symbolism] (based on like two (2) episodes) but idk what it's Leading To--like I get the gist but what is it Saying y'feel, what is the Comment and Uniting Theme

hawkmoth
i feel like it's harder to tell until the actual ending of the series, which feels like it comes out of nowhere based on what the series makes you think it was going for

a-flyleaf
oh yeah I'm not claiming to understand The Entire Series gjsdghsdf, moreso that everything so far hasn't been as incomprehensible as expected

hawkmoth
i exaggerate its incomprehensibility just to drive home to potential watchers that symbolism's more important than surface narrative, since if people do come here for the surface story the show will slap them in the face

a-flyleaf
yeah, duly noted; I think the show basically slams you in the face early on (like, right here, ep2, if the first didn't do you in already) that This Is All Heavily Symbolic
like I am primed to be looking for this stuff both because it's one of the reasons I'm watching the show and after talking lots of symbolism-level amphibia meta with Joy, but,,

[…]

hawkmoth
the egg/rebirth/revolution stuff is interesting tbh; they talk about changing the world but all they do is squabble over who gets to hold the rose bride (and follow orders from some shadowy powerful figure)
that's probably intentional

a-flyleaf
👀
now that is not a thing I noticed

hawkmoth
something something radical ideologies can be weaponised to maintain systems instead of dismantle them by diverting people's attention and energy?
and said people often have no idea who's really influencing them or who they benefit by acting this way?

a-flyleaf
👀 Mayhaps... the entire idea of playing into a system that no one really understands is like, Right There in utena and anthy's conversation

hawkmoth
eggs breaking just lead to more chickens, anyway

a-flyleaf
oh true, although ig it depends on the means of breaking

hawkmoth
gjdjgjdg yeah
the likeliest other outcome is that people smash the egg and the insides die

a-flyleaf
an egg hatching, which is vaguely implied by the metaphor ("the chick will die without ever being born"), is Very different from all the world-crumbling imagery we get from the intro
and yeah
that

hawkmoth [continuing]
leaving nothing instead of something better, which can be a problem with revolutionary ideas irl gjfjfjd

a-flyleaf
stuff like that song abruptly listing early prehistoric eras of the earth are pointing towards the birth/creation stuff, but I'm 👀 @ that because the latter option is always there and invoked by the intro
also, like, utena tried to lose that fight on purpose (death) but then T-pose mcgee flew down from the sky with a very conspicuous rose censor which.. idek man, but on the hypothetical binary it seems closer to the former (life restored/kept/fought for)
also yeah gjdhsjfds, and [the point about revolutionary ideas is] especially interesting given the dang show's name

bonus bit idk where else to put

I'm so pleasantly surprised by the goofier/lighthearted stuff tbh??
idk if that lasts all through the show but it almost feels like Normal Anime gjdfhjs

in conclusion we keysmash a lot